Talk:Quick Draw

Samurai Kirby

The GBA version of this minigame is clearly derivative of Samurai Kirby.

• The theme changed from wild west to feudal samurai.
• The same exact enemy lineup is used in Samurai Kirby.
• The reaction values for the first three opponents are exactly the same as in Samurai Kirby, with the last two (except Normal Dedede) altered to lower the difficulty.
• The Japanese name is the equivalent of "Samurai Kirby Revised"; the English translation using "Quick Draw" is likely a quick and easy asset reuse from Kirby's Adventure. Localizations around this time generally didn't do enough research, as can be seen when another sub-game, Gigaton Punch—a blatant reference to Megaton Punch—became "Crackity Hack".

Literally the only thing connecting it to the actual Quick Draw is that the reward threshold is borrowed from it, which is to be expected as the original Samurai Kirby was not integrated in the main game and this minigame is a replacement. Therefore, the information has room to split: either by merging the GBA content with the existing Samurai Kirby page, or by making "Quick Draw (Kirby: Nightmare in Dream Land)" its own article. AdieuLain (talk) 02:48, 2 September 2019 (UTC)

It doesn't matter if it is similar in all other respects to Samurai Kirby, because it literally goes by the name Quick Draw in Nightmare in Dream Land, and still follows the same basic premise as the version in Adventure. Merging it with Samurai Kirby would cause undue confusion for those expecting to read only about the Super Star version of the game, and there is no real need to split the article since it does not differ significantly from the Adventure version either. --Fubaka (talk) 02:53, 2 September 2019 (UTC)

Quick Draw and Samurai Kirby already follow the same basic premise as it is, though; the only real difference in gameplay is that the "FIRE!" cue was changed to a "!" mark, and even that was carried over to the GBA minigame. As for reader confusion, that goes both ways - I imagine others would still get just as confused visually seeing original western-style Quick Draw Kirby and Super Star-style Samurai Kirby next to each other, if not more so, and may neglect to scroll down to the names in other languages section at the bottom for a buried explanation. When you get down to it, it's obviously Samurai Kirby, not Quick Draw, in everything but English name, so why not simply present it that way? Not to mention, the original minigame had a follow-up called Kirby on the Draw and was also represented in NES Remix 2, so Quick Draw is likely more familiar as the western-themed minigame over the samurai anomaly at this point... AdieuLain (talk) 03:32, 2 September 2019 (UTC)

Again, I understand that it's basically the exact same game, but having this information moved to the sub-game for Super Star just wouldn't make sense. Imagine if you were a wiki reader who played Nightmare in Dream Land but not Super Star. You'd wonder where the information was, and would be baffled to find it on the Samurai Kirby page instead of Quick Draw. The same confusion would be present for someone visiting the Samurai Kirby page who never played Nightmare in Dream Land. --Fubaka (talk) 05:31, 2 September 2019 (UTC)

When we can use {{articleabout}} or {{distinguish}} for the occasion of having to make a conspicuous disclaimer at the top of the page, I just don't see the concern when the current setup noticeably sacrifices internal congruence. Imagine if you were a wiki reader who played Kirby's Adventure and Kirby Super Star but not the remakes (really not as unlikely as you'd think anymore considering Adventure received multiple re-releases on Wii / Wii U Virtual Console, Nintendo 3DS, Nintendo Switch Online, and via Dream Collection and NES Classic Edition, versus only Nightmare in Dream Land re-released on Wii U Virtual Console, and the original Super Star has almost as many re-releases as Kirby's Adventure). You'd wonder why Samurai Kirby is featured as the main image of Quick Draw, and would wonder why they got mixed up on the same page when there is already clearly a separate Samurai Kirby page for it. The same confusion would not exist for someone visiting the Samurai Kirby page who never played Nightmare in Dream Land, because they would be able to easily read and see on the same page that the Quick Draw from a game they haven't played is based on the Samurai Kirby that they recognize. I'm just saying, the initial confusion will exist with certain readers regardless of how it's organized, so we might as well strive for accuracy, no? AdieuLain (talk) 06:15, 2 September 2019 (UTC)

There is nothing dis-congruous about the current set-up, unless you are looking solely from the Japanese perspective, which this wiki does not. The game is called Quick Draw in international releases, and fills the same role in the remake as it did in the original. That it is essentially Samurai Kirby would be a stronger argument to move it if this was a Japanese wiki, since the name carries from the Super Star game in that region. As it stands, the confusion you mention can be somewhat mitigated if the page explicitly spells out the difference between the versions in the first paragraph or uses a double image in the infobox showing both versions. Would that be an agreeable compromise? --Fubaka (talk) 06:24, 2 September 2019 (UTC)

Separating the images and going into more detail would be preferable to how the article is currently written, but for the record, I'm not looking at it solely from the Japanese perspective as I made that my last bullet point. AdieuLain (talk) 06:32, 2 September 2019 (UTC)

I did not imply that you were. I was just using that as a reference point to state how despite there being a confusing similarity between the sub-games, it still makes sense for us to talk about it on this page, since both games are named the same, occupy the same role in their respective games, and play the same for the most part. If it's a mistake, then it's a mistake the localization team made, and we just have to live with it. --Fubaka (talk) 06:35, 2 September 2019 (UTC)

One more thing to add: in the "Kirby's History" musueum of Kirby's Dream Collection: Special Edition, only Bomb Rally and Kirby's Air Grind appear in the video for Kirby: Nightmare in Dream Land. Since leaving this Quick Draw out implies that it's not considered a new sub-game, that at least indicates that it should not be its own article. AdieuLain (talk) 21:14, 15 November 2019 (UTC)